hello again. luvullo here. i'm the guy who didn't use dark phoenix's or split infinities' methods in MR2 cuz they were too time consuming. now, because of a commitment to enter a monster in every class of fenrick's MR3 public tourney, i find myself raising a suezo using the dmm/campster method. this thread will track her progress towards her goal.

i add the campster's name to dmm's because of the thread "Tracking the Life of a Maxed Out Reilly, finished w/ the method" contained in the MR3 section of monster-rancher.com. one of the best raising explanations i have read in mr3. campster has taken dmm's brilliant idea, and added a few twists of his own to it.

that being said, i am not following either one of them by the letter. instead, i am trying my own spin on the thing. if the whole idea is to preserve lifespan while gaining stats, my angle is that there are three goals to achieve during each venture that lies at the heart of the dmm/campster: Refreshment, Stress Reduction, and Statgain. refreshment and stress reduction are gained through the dried rain carp/big shell/etc you find on expeditions. statgain is defined as 15+ from the cactus needles/teardrops of ice/etc you pick up while on venture. [so far my best is +25]

my angle is the "meat loaf" angle; that is, "2 out of 3 ain't bad". in an effort to save time [and the crumbling remnants of my sanity] any venture which achieves for me two out of the three goals i keep and move on; otherwise i reset and try again. even with these modest goals, i have already reset one time for more than 45 minutes, and a second time for more than a half hour, in the first year of sofia's life.

if you get the refreshment plus stress reduction, you get your points by getting greats in the 2 weeks after venture; if you dont get greats then you have to reset again. greats are not a sure thing, but 2 out of the 3 times i have gotten those 2 in the meat loaf scheme, i have gotten the greats.

so here's where i stand in the process. at 11 months, sofia has the following profile:

lif	pow	int	spd	def	= composite
463	185	491	495	214	= 1848
battle sense = C	form = slim

techs: lick, lvl 1;beam lvl 2;noise,lvl 10;psychokinesis lvl 1. noise was the stone tech that was the forte of the heart i gave her.

battle sense just knows, somehow, that i dont like it, and it doesnt like me back. this is the one part of the campster's blueprint that i have followed - sofia is at "a" level, and has fought an enemy monster on all ventures but 2. yet she cannot get her battle sense above "c level". oh well.

here's the bad news...i am summarizing her accomplishments at 11 months cuz that's when she grew. ack! short life ahead! and suezos hit their prime a lot earlier than suzurins - at 1 yr, she is already at near peak in statgain from drills. i have got to make hay the next year, or lose any chance of maxing her. as i type this, i have gained another 250 points by 1 yr 1 mo, but i cannot say for sure whether that will be enough to get her to max.

i will keep you all posted.

i expected serious $$$ issues to arise - my zan and cc cost me 70,000 to prep for their tourneys. however, i have been pleasantly surprised by my dummy monsters' ability to get up to around 3000 composite and win several s level tourneys. so, as of now, i have around 40,000 gs more than i started with! done the way i am doing it, in fact, this is almost a "money monster" kind of method - not what i expected at all!

Lynx, although this is redundant, Let's see. 6 month old monster with stats all above 550. Well, let's do the math. The Fenrick save which is the compilation of saves from over 15 people has the highest stat'd monster I know of at 757 (or 150 per category) total. It's a Naga. Now let's pretend you gave it a maxed out heart. That'd give you 199 bonus in each category. Or about 350 per guy to start. So, you're saying using my version of "DMM's" method you gained over 1000 points in the first 6 months of life. 1000 points divided by 24 training weeks with no failures is (drum roll please) 41.6 points per week. Even doing hard drills, you would gain about 10-12 points a week off training. So that's 31 points a week per venture from leaves and stuff. 600 ran ran steps is 12 light of earth spots. 2 used by very refreshed and very relieved of stress. That leaves 10 spots to search (remember, averages people). so we averaged 3.1 points per search without finding any other items or monsters to fight. Although this is technically possible, even I'm not anal enough to shoot for these kind of results.

I want the save. email it to me thecampster@yahoo.com I'd be happy to validate for you to anyone else here.

Now, why am I so sure of this math I just posted. I took the heart of Reilly (the maxed out monster) and placed it in a KungFu Dragon named "BruceLee" (Beginning stats of about 1650 w/heart or 330/stat). He turned 1 year old last night. Now, I haven't followed my own method to the letter of the law as with his starting stats there was no reason too, but I have done it 8 of the first 12 months. So I did my method 2 months longer than you and trained normally for 4 additional months. I'm Rank 'S', battle sense "B" but you seem to have 400 more stat points than me.....Hmmm. More importantly, you said you had 9 million gold instead of 9 hundred thousand.

At 1 year 0 months old, BruceLee is at

L-435
P-506
I-562
S-423
D-447

Lastly, thank you for calling it my method but I only adjusted it for my purposes. It's not mine. It's the brainchild of DigMoshMogi.

Torey, I'll see you at the tourney. As far as emaciated goes and this method. As you know I maxed the stats end of this at 3 years, 5 months. I rested for 7 months and got back to thin. large eggs or honey candy didn't work for me. Feeding Meat will help, but it must be constant. My guy was gaga for nuts and peaches and that's what did it. BruceLee eats mainly Meat, fish and peaches and is normal.

thanx for the math. i have never minded the characteristic "vegetarian" because you can usually feed a normal monster the right combo of nuts and veggies such that it performs well. however, it may be that being a vegetarian is incompatible with raising a monster dmm/campster style. oh well, at least i will discover whether being emaciated has any deleterious side effects, cuz i am pushing forward!

Wow, I haven't done anything yet cuz im so busy this month, maybe next month too. Well, nice suezo, Torey. Its prolly emaciated cuz u work it too hard. Its training/battling more than its eating, huh?

i have a feeling that, unless you feed it high fat items [aka meats] that the exertion of constant ventures wears a monsters form down. i am still wondering how to solve this problem - or, indeed, if it is even a problem at all...

I have a question Torey, or anyone else who uses that training method regularly. What do you do if you are on a venture and you don't find all or any of the refreshing or stress relieving items you are searching for, however you do aquire a very good characteristic, like sharp eyes, or magic wisdom/secrets, or some other benifitial trait? Do you reset and lose the characteristic, or do you let the venture slide that one time? Now i understand that you would be less likely to do this with Sophia because of how important she is, but what about a monster that you aren't raising to be ground breaking?

actually, i faced this question with sofia, when i got magic wisdom, only about 6 points and slight refreshment. a lot depends on where i am in the cycle - sometimes she goes to venture seems healthy, other times she is very tired. if it had been the latter, i would have had to reject the shelley, because i really needed the refreshment - in those cases, i have rejected 29 points of statgain. however, i was lucky, sofia was not on her last legs [er, tail] and so i could take that result and just depend on my next venture to give me the "refreshment that i needed".

If you followed my similar saga on the other site, I admitted that I screwed up alot in the first 12-18 months of doing this and was still able to cut the method off at 2 years 9 months and still max out by 3 years 5 months. If done right, you could cut the method off by 1 year 6 months to 2 years old. So cutting corners one week to acquire a wisdom, sharp eyes, fast footwork or any other desirable characteristic would be the smarter move.

We all agree that a well raised no method monster should be able to get around a 3000 stat composite. So what this method is doing, is to acquire 2000 more. Well, If you did the method for 2 years, that's about 24 more drills at 12 points a piece or 360 points. Now your down to 1640. And over 2 years there's 96 weeks to venture with this method. 1640/96 = 17.1. So in reality if you just gain an extra 17 to 18 points a week in venture for the first 2 years, you're done. So fooling around a couple of weeks for an accessory, a characteristic or an orb (all of which I did) is completely acceptable and in my opinion, encouraged.

These maxed monsters are for tournaments only. No fool would do this to beat Ragnarox. That's like bringing crazy uncle Ricky to beat up the playground bully. So if you're going to a tourney and stumble upon an orb, accessory or good characteristic, for Bragma's sake take it and extend the method a week.

By the way, BruceLee has found 2 different accessories. "Horn" and "Horns". "Horn" is a small Unicorn like spike for his forehead. "Horns" are 2 ram like rounded horns for the side of his head. Yes, I kept both and slid the stats on the venture. I actually rested after one to keep the accessory.

Which local do you guys usually use for venturing?
For my Angel, i have been doing the Real Thing drill in Takrama the thrid week of the month before a venture, then hopping over to Kalaragi and doing the Life Risk drill on the fourth week, then i venture, hibernate and repeat. this is taking a tediously long time, since i am doing: drill, drill, venture, hibernate, drill, drill, venture, hibernate, etc.. By doing the Real Thing drill i can raise Int and Def while dropping Pow, and with the Life Risk drill i can raise Spd, and Lif while dropping Pwr. Halo (my angel)is now 7 months old and still has yet to get a great and i can't figure out why. Anyway sorry for blabbering on.

so far, #1 venture spot for sofia is goat. #2 is kalaragi, and #3 is brillia. this is based more on my familiarity with the light of earth/bad feeling spots there than any perceived advantages on my part. after resetting 20 times, the big shells start to blur into the crystal eggs, etc. i mostly know where i am going in takrama, and i have ventured there a few times. im afraid id miss something in morx...

update: 2 yrs 1 mo. lost aloof, now is normal/normal. she is clearly out of prime already, so i am having to try to squeeze out more points on venture. current composite: 3499.

still on track, but getting tougher.

2 yrs 1 mo. and you're out of Prime???? Dang, what evil, twisted training schedule have you been giving her?

the dmm/campster schedule, which is as twisted as they come. however, even raised more normally, suezos hit prime early and come out of it early as well. 2 yr 3 mo now, 3670...a couple of good ventures and trainings can make a trainer feel almost good about using this meth...nope, not even that, not even almost! ^_^

especially the usazo type i am using, listed in prima as a "very early bloomer".

Well, at least you have a good composite stat score. No real chance of maxxing, but still a high and mighty monster.

Torey,

For comparison, Reilly was at 4031 at 2 years 6 months. You're right. You are a little behind that schedule, but I did quit the method at 2 years 9 months and 3 weeks and went to raising normally. Remembering I got the stats done at 3 years and 5 months.

We'll assume Sophia lives to 3 years 10 months. That's 1325 more in points needed. 1 year and 7 months left is 19 months or 76 weeks. That's 17.43 a week. You'll make it, but my real questions is how is the Tech raising coming. I snuck 4 ventures in my way with full battle sense. I was at levels 7, 5, 5, 8 in my 4 techs. Where do you stand now?

You mean that somebody has actually maxxed a monster out? You've gotta be kidding me... Did you really max Reilly? I never read anything about that...

i am max at noise, and lvl 5 in beam. only lvl 1 in the other 2. 3740 at 2 yr 4 mos, so she will not catch the pace of reilly.

khift if you scroll waaaaaay up to the top of this thread, you will see the citation to the thread about how campster maxed reilly.

i am going to post in the appropriate thread as well, but i have one experience to support skeleton witch's seasonal correction to failure weeks idea. my suezo just was doomed to fail aug4. tried every drill everywhere. so i put her back to sleep, and got out my joker. interestingly enough, i also tried every possible drill for him, and he failed them all...well, thats why they call it a "dummy" i guess. when nov4 rolled around, out came sofia, who did just fine! hardly constitutes proof, but it certainly fits the pattern.

Oh, I see it now. Thanks for pointing that out, Torey.

and maxing is still pretty much attainable, khift - campster is right, tho, my loss will be in tech levels, unless i choose to stop short of maxing and get a few tech levels instead.

well, sofia is not going to live to see 4 years, so she is taking lifespan hits in a major way. even my dummy monsters, who hardly get any stress at all except for battling, dont live as long as they should. there may be something about altering the "light of earth" experience, or in hibernating, or in the combination of the two, that just is harder on our beasties than we know.

Torey, what was your training method bar at? was it at Harder, hard, etc..? That might be why your monster's lifespan was shortened.

Don't think so, I was at normal most of the time and I didn't even stick to the method hard core, but I too experienced excessive life loss. His weight was between normal and chunky depending on what was fed and diet grass. Only really variables were I found 3 accessories, I changed locations alot after saving (this I think may contribute to higher stress ie life loss...but not sure), over fed meat I think...he loved it every other week 4/3 or 4/4 and seemed to get a ton of evil leech spots.

Torey, any thoughts???

sorry, this message was on monster BruceLee, not Reilly.

mine was hard/harder until about one year when it reverted back to normal - which is pretty much standard for me. this may well cause life loss during the first year [although my excessive battles during that time had more to do with it, i think] but my dmm monster lost more during the first year than my other monsters did, even ones who also battled up to a level. on lisa's chart, a suezo's lifespan is not excessively short - i lost 9 months along the way...

I just counted...I lost 8 months...(32 weeks). Don't think I battled that much. Maybe 15 venture battles and 6 tourneys (21 battles). So I lost 11 weeks more somewhere.

done. all 999s. emaciated. noise lvl 10[maxx]; beam lvl 7 [maxx]; psychokinesis lvl 4; lick lvl 1. 3 yrs 10 mos with maybe a week to spare.

ugh. raising the pixie for lisa's tourney is going to be fun. hell, even raising the dummy monsters was fun. raising this suezo was no fun at all. ah well, at least i have a master tourney entrant, a good heart, and the ability to say "i maxxed a monster".

Were you letting her rest? If not, then I feel sorry for the poor Suezo... I've recently been raising a Tanuzo (Morx version) myself for the Sharp Eyes and Sweet Smell and I've grown quite... attached... to the odd thing. I've noticed how it's reactions changed. When it was happy earlier it would bounce around, but now it just gives me one big-••• grin that fills up half the screen (No kidding). I think I might raise more of them.

heh - nope, khift. the reason that i could maxx out sofia is because she never got a day of rest in her life until very late in the game.

i felt sorry for her too, though, when i saw what had become of her.

did campster rest his Reilly?

near the end he did - i think reilly got more rest than sofia did

i have never gone without resting a monster. what happens? do they run away to rest or something?

not if you keep them refreshed and free of stress, which is accomplished through [an ungodly number of] resets of ventures until you find the right combinations of big shells or crystal eggs or dried rain carp, etc, that leave your monster very refreshed and stress-free coming out of venture, when you then put it to sleep until next time of venture. however, as i found out with sofia, they lose their form to slim to thin to emaciated.

Torey, I didn't lose form on BruceLee or Harry (at 1 year 2 months now composite of 2294), but they are both gaga for Meat and get it every other week. What was the main staple of Sophia's diet. I'll bet, that just like in MR2, Nuts-Carrots-hagsan peach adjust form with a negative number and that hurls them toward skinny/emaciated quickly. Conversely, Meat/Fish and a few other are heavy on form. Now, rest also seems to help form which is why without the right foods and rest, it seems to push us so quickly to thin.

Harry's done. 999 all cat's

mocchi cannon max
gagaccha max
mochikki 4
mossaman 1

just an update. I screwed up my own method or I could've maxed techs.

Wow, a 3rd maxxed monster.... I think this is going to get big soon.

ok... wheres that meathod? i looked
everywhere and couldnt find it

Look in the methods section. DMM's method has three threads there.

Zidane,

I just posted my interpretation of DMM's method 7 threads down. It's my version of the method. Find the thread "Flexible DMM/Campster method 7ish threads down from this thread for my step by step explanation. I went into great detail of how to raise all through life.

Lisa, the dmm thread seems locked. If you would, you can move it to that thread as it seems to belong there. I couldn't add a new thread to the raising method area either...it seems locked.

ok thanx